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What Would Wildlife Say About Concealed Carry in National Parks?

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Much of the debate over the rule change that allows national park visitors to arm themselves has been filled with vitriol. But no one, it seems, has considered the wildlife's point of view.

Instead the debate has been waged over 2nd Amendment rights, fear of drug runners, smugglers, and fellow hikers, fear of dangerous wildlife, and even fear of gun owners.

As the accompanying photo shows, perhaps we should also fear bears that come upon handguns in the parks.

Comments

"What about "controlled" burns? Doesn't this activity kill lots of animals in the name of "ecosystem management" ? What about the seemingly arbitrary decision to let a forest fire "burn itself out" ? Depending on the time of year these ghastly infernos can burn through a lot of wildlife."- Beamis

Controlled burns don't often kill wildlife. See:

Fire at the wildland interface: the influence of experience and mass media on public knowledge, attitudes, and behavioral intentions

There are many more examples of literature documenting the mortality of wildlife associated with wildland fires and controlled burns.

Cars on the other hand do impact (no pun intended) wildlife numbers.

However, the difference between allowing cars (or even restricting transportation to mass transit) into the parks and allowing armed visitors into the park, is that without transportation most visitors would not be able to enjoy the park as the organic act allows.

Not allowing loaded weapons into parks doesn't inhibit the park from achieving the requirements set forth by the organic act. While allowing loaded weapons into the park may actually go against the regulations of the organic act. However, nobody will know for sure until a study is done.


As an old friend of mine used to say: "Wolves don't vote, piping plovers don't lobby, and ginseng doesn't contribute to political candidates...unfortunately!!

Bill Wade
Chair, Executive Council
Coalition of National Park Service Retirees


Well Lee, we will see if your belief is correct or mine. Time will tell. I do not beleive that more deaths of wildlife will occur from CCW holders than happened before without considering many were carrying without the legal sanction.

The panic behavior that visitors exhibit when coming face to face often already has tragic results when the animal follow the chase instinct. But surprisingly actual history has not indicated that to have happened very often, people do read the NPS advice and do follow directions. However on actual hostile attacks between wildlife and humans, the use of firearms have saved humans. I think that is the correct result.

So to see some accounts of cougar attack this cite has listings http://users.frii.com/mytymyk/lions/attacks3.htm
This is not limited to NPS settings.


Kurt,
I too commend you for attempting to bring in some levity. It was a nice change. I have seen and responded to quite a few posts and have been thinking..... Why don't they let us first carry paintball guns concealed! Then they could count the number of paint rounds expended on animals, signs, people, or whatever. Then we would have an accurate account of the impact real guns would have! ( Unless, of coarse, all the lefties buy paintball guns and go buck wild (pun intended) on wildlife and such) But they (lefties) wouldn't do that would they? On another note, I wish all the pro- gun people would stop making us look like idiots. The 2nd amendment has little to NOTHING to do with CCDW! It says "a well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed." There is NOTHING in there giving us the right to carry concealed! It gives us the right to own guns ! If anything it says right there, bear arms.... meaning to show or have, as in bear your backside, which is what you do when you try to use the 2nd amendment to argue for concealed carry.

PS- can anyone "read" bears? I believe the last guy that thought he could and actually "lived" with them named Timothy Treadwell, the so called self -taught expert, sadly was killed by a bear in 2003. A tragic death for sure.


A very thoughtful response. Common sense sholud rule. CCW permit holders are not just gun owners or registered gun owners. They have gone the extra mile for some training (though minor) and a back ground check to make sure they are not convicted felons.

Environmental Impact Report? For what? CCW carriers aren't going out there to target practice. What a waste of taxpayer money. How can you forecast animal incidents with CCW carriers that haven't happened?


Nobody can predict bear behavior (especially over a long period of time). However, it is possible to read their behavior in a way that will help a person predict their next move. I am not talking "horse whisperer" reading, but bear experts can tell you if a bear is acting aggressive or is unconcerned.

So... Anonymous seems to think that many CCW holders are already breaking the law... From what other CCW holders are saying that is not true. Who is right?

This is just a thought, but the illegality of having a loaded weapon in parks may be enough of a motivation that CCW or CCDW (I don't know which acronym is correct...) who have been in parks arm themselves with other defenses or they just are more patient when it comes to bear/human interactions.... (They ask questions first, shoot later)

I could come up with theories (as could every other person here), but a study is really what is needed. The challenge will be to have one done that doesn't get challenged and held up in court for the next 10 years. And good luck to the researcher who tries to get that study through the Office of Management and Budget. OMB doesn't like studies investigate polarizing topics.


Actually, if more people were armed, then animals would be afraid of people and stay away from them like they used to rather than thinking that they are unarmed prey like the Mt. Tamalpais lady. Oh, that's right! People were more worried about the orphaned cats than the orphaned kids. There are also National Forests that have been taken over by druggies, so a few law-abiding citizens killing them would be a good thing.


Bears shoot in the woods? You mean I had it wrong all these years?


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