| Page 1477 | National Parks Traveler

Want to see something silly? Look at what the CONsent decree says has to happen on Sept 15; 26. After September 15 all remaining unhatched turtle nests, once they reach their hatch window, shall be protected by full beach closures, in addition to the fencing methodology described in the Interim Strategy.

Aug 27th - 15:01pm | dapster

Anon, Quote: "It's actually the state of North Carolina and the FWS who oppose moving turtle nests and with good reason."

Aug 27th - 12:24pm | Anonymous

It's actually the state of North Carolina and the FWS who oppose moving turtle nests and with good reason.

Aug 27th - 09:26am | dapster

It is indeed a fact that in the CHNSRA, Post-CD, all nests within the 50-day window require full beach closures for a certain distance either side of the nest to ORV’s and in some cases pedestrians as well. The reason for this is: Tire tracks make it difficult for the hatchlings to reach the sea after hatching. That makes sense, but here’s the kicker: Beaches are closed from 10PM until 6AM.

Aug 27th - 08:28am | Anonymous

Nice to see that Cape Hatteras is finally doing what it needs to to protect wildlife at the seashore. It's been overrun by 4x4s for far too long.

Presidential Politics and the National Parks

Aug 27th - 15:39pm | Ted Clayton

Kurt, Oops. Though I can be a bit daring, I try to recognize when conflicting viewpoints are no longer 'discussing'; when the struggle is whether the glass is half-full, or half-empty. "Semantics", etc.

Aug 27th - 14:19pm | Kurt Repanshek

Ahh, Ted, you dare to embark on the debate over the meaning of "conserve" v. "preserve."

Aug 27th - 14:01pm | Ted Clayton

Good wrap-up, Kurt! The quote that you extract from the Democratic Party draft platform uses the word "conserve" for non-Park lands, and "protect" for the Parks. It then segues back to "conserve", in mentioning millions of new acres for hunting & fishing. Nowhere in this passage do we see "preserve", and that may be significant.

Aug 27th - 10:27am | Andrea

Thanks, Kurt! Check out the ads here: www.npca.org/media_center/psas or watch a video production of Sam Waterson's radio PSA created by a Law&Order fan.

4-Year-old Dies in Fall off South Rim of Grand Canyon

Aug 27th - 14:22pm | Danielle

i think its the parks fault. they need to make sure that the park is secure not just for children, but for everyone. the grand canyon is a huge cliff and if anyone lost their balance or anything else they need a fence or something to keep them from falling off. i mean they shouldnt even allow people to be that close to the edge.

Grammar Vigilantes Busted in Grand Canyon National Park, Barred from Park System

Aug 27th - 13:36pm | ElJayDubya

It seems to me that the action by park service and courts simply effects the restoration of a historical site to its original condition.

Aug 27th - 10:59am | Kath

OK. Let's have a little fun. What spelling/grammatical errors have you spotted on signs in parks. I'll start. There's a sign at Pt. Dume, Malibu, California (a state beach) which talks about the sea life clinging to the rocks as 'muscles'. Now unless Arnold himself is down on the shore, the spelling should be 'mussels'.

Aug 27th - 10:50am | Jonathan

Have you read the horrible grammar that is on the brass plaque that was left on the coast of California by Sir Francis Drake? I don't think I would change that either.

Aug 27th - 07:32am | Rangertoo

I think some comments are missing the point. This is not prosecution for correcting a typo, it is prosecution for damaging a historic resource. (Yes, "a" historic). The plaque is part of the original building design. more than 60 years old, and is hand lettered. We would expect the NPS to prosecute anyone who damages a historic sign, typo or not.

Aug 27th - 07:22am | Kurt Repanshek

Ted, All that remains of Jeff Deck's website can be found here. However, if you read the attachment I provided, it contains some screen shots of the site as well as verbiage from it. Thanks for your thoughts on this, Doug.

Aug 27th - 01:51am | Doug

As I used your post as a reference in mine, I figured I should alert you about my take on the situation, which can be read here: http://uselessdoug.blogspot.com/2008/08/doing-it-for-kids.html

Aug 26th - 23:26pm | Ted Clayton

Kurt, was there an editorial or typographic oversight in this post? ;-) I read, 'Yada, yada yada' ... "... explains one section of the web site." ... but I don't see a link to it. What website?

Aug 26th - 22:57pm | Ron Scofield

There is only one thing that bugs me more than typos and that is someone with built-in spellcheck that highlights the typos by making corrections on the printed material with bold markers or white out. You can't find the original authors most of the time and you loose the original flavor. [Ed. Here at Traveler we do make typo corrections to make sure that the intended meaning is conveyed.

Aug 26th - 22:11pm | Anonymous

This is INSANE. This kind of thing is why I hate the Parks system. I love the parks, but the system and the self righteous, jerks that work there can go to Hades.

Aug 26th - 21:42pm | Anonymous

I understand the punishment. Regardless of the grammatical improvement, it is most probably vandalism. I am concerned, however, that park officials reinserted what was deleted. I wonder what their thinking was: Let's correct the vandalism by restoring the grammatical errors?

Aug 26th - 20:29pm | Anonymous

$3,035.00 for a hand-rendered sign? Who is the criminal?

The Economist Warns that America’s National Park System is in Deep, Deep Trouble

Aug 27th - 12:55pm | Ted Clayton

Kirby et al, An important part of my reaction to concerns expressed here on the National Parks Traveler that we are at risk of 'Shock & Awe' development in the Parks, stems from my experience with Olympic Nat'l Park. I have only superficial & spotty exposure to other Parks.

Aug 27th - 09:25am | Kirby Adams

To me, this isn't about whether Frank can get to his solitude now, but whether his children or grandchildren will have that option. It's a fact that a majority (vast majority, in many cases) of the land in each park is wild, kidless, and free of anthropocentric sound. Take Ted's beloved Olympic. There are about 5 or 6 places, each the size of a soccer field or two, that everyone gathers.

Aug 26th - 21:33pm | Ted Clayton

Frank; I believe the real idea behind making Parks, that made making Parks (etc) a Great Idea, was the notion to preserve the physical resource itself. Why is the physical preservation of an area a Great Idea? Because it is a concept that many people can relate & resonate to ... and can agree upon.

Aug 26th - 19:38pm | Anonymous

this is a great post, and a very interesting discussion. @ saltsage236:

Aug 26th - 19:33pm | Ted Clayton

SaltSage236; You are really so right! I felt silly bringing it up myself, since it so obvious an experience for those who head into "the backcountry". I am really familiar only with Olympic National Park, but I am really familiar with it!

Aug 26th - 18:48pm | Ted Clayton

"In the morning, you'll still be ugly" The story goes, Winston Churchill had spent the evening at one of those necessary 'social functions', and had indulged one or several more alcoholic beverages than protocol required.

Aug 26th - 17:55pm | SaltSage236

Thank God national parks often have a reputation for being wilderness-challenged tourist traps full of the screaming, littering masses.

Aug 26th - 17:02pm | mantz

A couple more comments, if you'll allow me:

Aug 26th - 16:08pm | mantz

I think the article raises some interesting issues and makes some interesting points but fails to provide any hard facts on the main issue, that is the reasons for people’s reluctance to visit US national parks.

Aug 26th - 14:05pm | Kirby Adams

Allow me to lighten the mood with a "dumb foreigner" story....

Aug 26th - 13:52pm | Kirby Adams

Anon said: in my experience, anything labeled a national park on a map is something that receives heavy visitation anyway, so you wilderness folks can get over yourselves when dismissing the crowds who really need to visit them.

Aug 26th - 13:18pm | SaltSage236

Well said, Lone Hiker. I was born in 1977, and my Boy Scout upbringing has definitely rubbed off on my adult life (and those of my friends). I'd much rather go 'splore the wilderness than sit before a video game. Those "gamers" are totally foreign to me, much moreso than any non-English speaking visitor enjoying the view at the Grand Canyon.

Aug 26th - 12:47pm | Lone Hiker

Entertainment is obviously unique to the individual. I don't consider horse or dog tracks entertaining, but they rake in millions annually. The thought of parking my butt on a beach and reading a book is tantamount to a living hell, but again, it's the preferred method of thousands of weekenders and vacationers.

Aug 26th - 12:11pm | SaltSage236

Anonymous wrote: i realize the nps has a different mission statement than promoting recreation, but why should people pay taxes to support something they don't use? people won't protect, defend or pay for something they don't love or understand, if people stop using the parks at current numbers, i'd hate to see what happens.

Aug 26th - 11:54am | jsmacdonald

Often, when it comes to national parks, there is a clash of values that doesn't fit very neatly. First of all, there is inherent in any discussion of park visitation the issue of economic class. Since parks were created in part for "the benefit and enjoyment of the people," anything that tends to meet the use of some people at the expense of others will always have critics.

Aug 26th - 10:51am | Rick Smith

We live in a pluralistic society. There will always be people who would rather go to Disney World than to Denali, Gates of the Arctic, or Gettysburg. That’s fine. That’s what makes our society so fascinating. What we as a society must be careful about while preserving these parks is that we do not sacrifice their special values in an attempt to be all things to all people.

Aug 26th - 10:37am | Bob Janiskee

Sorry, Anon, but your unscientific sample doesn't cut it. I stand by my statement that "desolate" is ridiculously inappropriate for this context. Do you really believe that our national parks would be deserted if the Europeans were not there?!

Aug 26th - 10:08am | Anonymous

Having just returned from the parks in southern Utah, the statement "Were it not for British and German tourists enjoying the weak dollar, the parks would be desolate." is a stretch, but not an asinine statement.

Aug 26th - 09:07am | Betty H

I totally agree with Barkys' August 25th post ! Let free enterprise "entertain" folks outside our National Parks. The National Parks were saved as "National Treasures" to preserve and protect their natural beauty !

Aug 26th - 01:18am | Anonymous

"Environmentalists pose the greatest obstacle to restoring national park attendance to historically higher norms; by blocking needed convenience- and entertainment- related developments in the parks, environmentalists have taken away the main tool for increasing park attractiveness." THAT, folks, is the Inconvenient Truth!!!

Aug 25th - 22:12pm | VINK80

As an 84 year old that has visited most of these parks over the past 50 or so years I would hope that more and more people would have the same thoughts as Frank C about our parks. If pure natural wilderness & wildlife doesn't "entertain" people let them

Aug 25th - 21:28pm | Anonymous

if the national parks weren't for people to use, they would need to be called something different than a park:

Aug 25th - 20:36pm | Barky

Just to respond to the somewhat vitriolic attitude of some that I, or other like-minded folks on this board, are "environmental whackos", I will only say this:

Glacier National Park Officials Plan to Scale Down Search for Missing Hiker

Aug 26th - 22:58pm | Anonymous

Best wishes to Yi-Jien Hwa and his family. I had the opportunity to hang with a group of Malaysian climbers in Nepal- they were most accomodating and it has remained a fond memory ever since. As a Montanan, I hope for the best in this difficult situation. T

Lodging Deals Can Be Found In Olympic, Yosemite, and Mesa Verde National Parks

Aug 26th - 17:20pm | SovereignTraveler

Great article!

Comment Period For Revised Gun Regulations for National Parks About to Close

Aug 26th - 17:06pm | Drew Bingaman

Speaking of Gettysburg, it is the prime example of why the firearm prohibitions in national parks rule needs to be revised, First of all it isn't easy to determine within the town of Gettysburg where the town ends and the national park begins, it is an insane burden upon someone who is otherwise legally carrying a firearm for self protection.

MSNBC’s Top 10 National Park Lodges List Draws Curmudgeonly, but Gentle Criticism

Aug 25th - 21:40pm | vink80

Hooray and well said ---- from an 84 year old that has visited most of these parks over the past 50 or so years and seen the areas turned into "some damn country club" and agree whole heartedly that some important factors have been lost.

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